Re: Yes, Modern Assemblers Can Be Productive

From: Beth (BethStone21_at_hotmail.NOSPICEDHAM.com)
Date: 10/13/03 

Date: Mon, 13 Oct 2003 12:10:55 +0100

The_Sage wrote:
> > Beth wrote:
> >>>Oh, so you're just "misunderstood"...poor dear...shame I don't
care in
> >>>your case because it's all just bullcrap...
>
> >>Yet another intellectual comeback from the peanut gallery! Thank
you for proving
> >>my other point: the the people who frequenct this newsgroup aren't
the brightest
> >>group on the web :^)
>
> >Well, can't speak for others, but, in my case, yes, indeed...would
> >never make any claims otherwise...I'm a right dunce at times, for
> >sure...a complete moron...
>
> I appreciate honesty...

Well, that's just a lie but we'll let it slide this one time...

> but I disagree with you that you are a complete moron.

Oh, then, in fact, I've NOT proved any such point about the people who
frequent this newsgroup at all, have I, as you stipulated? And I've
gone and made you instantly contradict yourself with but a single
disarming reply...and now you're saying the complete reverse...so much
for that comeback coming from the peanut gallery, eh?

I would, to be polite, extend the same courtesy in return back to
you...but, well, you "appreciate honesty" so, well, nope, you're just
a complete moron...no redeeming features that you've yet
displayed...it would be Lovely to say differently but, well, that's
the bummer about honesty, isn't it? :)

> >But, ummm, are we to draw from this comment that you're saying that
> >you, on the other hand, are supremely intelligent and "on a higher
> >plane" compared to everyone here?
>
> Haha! You really believe I would think that?

Yes, unquestionably so...little else could rationally explain your
conduct...and, thus far, I would at least like to extend the benefit
of the doubt that you're not doolally crazy or anything like that...

> There are times when I look at some
> posts:
>
> Please tell me which BIOS function to call to read a file!
> How do I read and set the MBR?
> What are the command line parameters for MASM 1.2?
>
> ...and I think to myself (in the same order as given above):
>
> Can't you do your own homework assignments?

Or, perhaps, they are perfectly capable of doing their homework
assignments but just weren't told where to look for the
information...trust me, some teachers are so far up their own arses at
times - similar in spirit to your good self - that even the blatantly
obvious passes them by...like, you know, telling people where to at
least look for the information...

And don't you go pulling high and mighty or anything...because if you
were just learning about various subjects, would you know even _WHERE_
to find out the answers to: "please tell me the range of mass and
luminosity generally found for the irregular galaxies, where the Milky
Way's mass and luminosity are defined as one for comparison?"...or
"Name three properties of a star connected to its spectral line
shape"...or similar questions that, _sure_, an astronomer would
immediately know exactly where to look but most everyone else would be
entirely stumped...not just having no idea what the answer is but no
idea even where to look for the answers...

And, sure, with enough time, you could probably scour the entire web
and eventually find the answers...but this would probably be a week
_after_ the deadline for the assignment...

Pointers as to where particular information can be found are perfectly
valid and acceptable...and, if you could even begin to comprehend
social psychology, then you'd realise that learners are very likely to
phrase questions loosely ("please tell me which functions..." rather
than "where do I find...") because when you're new to a subject or
finding out something new, it's very wise to be delibrately vague in
your questions so as to field the widest response...say the answer was
"do it yourself" then the first vaguer question will prompt this as a
response ("which functions...?" / "The functions you write")...but the
second unnecessarily precise question is a perfect set-up for a
pathetic smartarse answer ("where do I find...?" / "Nowhere, you've
already found it" and no more said about the subject to clarify that
they've already found it because _they themselves_ are where home-made
routines are to be found)...

Thus, you're simply taking things far too literally because, as you've
demonstrated innumerable times, you have no concept of empathy at
all...and this is no compliment, as the ability to do this is usually
one of the "intelligence" criteria cited by "experts" in the field and
even animals can empathise with creatures that aren't even its own
species and rear them as if their own...or a new dog to the family
being shown around by the old dog (as long as it's not jealous of the
attention or anything)...chimps literally _do_ display more evidence
of being able to empathise than you do (they're pretty sociable
animals :), with little to no exaggeration there...

Recognise that lacking empathy makes you a bit stupid, not "Lord and
Master of them all" because you're on some imagined "higher plane" or
something...again, I'd normally be more courteous here but you said
you appreciated honesty...

> Why does an amatuer like you want to create a virus?

Manipulating an MBR need not necessarily have anything whatsoever to
do with viruses whatsoever...there's simple education...there's
putting together the basics of a simple OS (which, in turn, is an
educational process to work with the machine when it's
OS-less)...there's even the possibility of trying to repair a damaged
MBR this way, where other standard tools are known to simply overwrite
them and wreck them ("FDISK" can "repair" an MBR by just writing out a
new one)...unfortunately, the MBR is a pretty delicate data structure,
as it's a single point of failure that could render _an entire system_
lost in but a single stroke (and OSes tend to back up their own
bootsectors but not necessarily the overall system MBR...plus, anyway,
if you can't find the start of the OS file system that's got the
back-up then you won't be able to locate it to copy it back,
anyhow...due to the nature of what the MBR is, it's actually a very
delicate and weak spot in the system)...

For those who've just one massive partition and one OS, they might not
see it...but if you've got multiple partitions and then the MBR gets
screwed up, writing a new simple "one partition, one OS" MBR would
lose you all but the first OS (and it might mess up that OS, anyway,
to be told its file system is bigger than it really is...FAT wouldn't
care too much but NTFS and iNode-based stuff could start playing up if
given the wrong values for the size of the partition they are
operating in because they span out across the whole partition, not
just work their way from the start of it...HPFS and NTFS put their
main stuff in the _middle_ of the disk so if given the wrong size and
the first few sectors are what was screwed up - which usually contain
a pointer to where to look for this stuff, as a back-up for locating
it - then not knowing the size of a partition could prove
problematic...in fact, that's why they include little "signatures" on
the disk, which serve no real great purpose other than to give "hints"
for data recovery...that is, the important system structures start
with a certain signature so, if all else fails, you can scour the disk
for the signature to help locate it manually, if you're lucky)...it's
a point of failure with potentially catastrophic results (this is, in
fact, one of the reasons viruses target this area)...

Now, you might say "but if it's so delicate and important, why is
someone playing around with it?"...simple, if no other tool will be
able to repair it then you've got nothing to lose, anyway, so you
might as well have a go...unlike the computer which has now got
screwed up values in the MBR, you can at least probably remember the
rough sizes and the number of partitions and the order you install
them on from your own memory...so, as a last resort, you might not
have much chance of recovery but the alternative is "no chance of
recovery at all" so you might as well give it a shot...learn about
MBRs and stuff while you're at it too...

I am totally against viruses completely...I despise the things and
don't admire them in any way...but I've looked at MBRs and
bootsectors...no object is in itself inherently "wrong"...it's the
intent of the person using it that's "wrong"...with proper good
intent, learning about the MBR might end up yielding a stand-alone
hobby OS or another data recovery expert or a new "BootMagic"-like
utility for everyone to use or whatever...with bad intent, sure, it
could be a virus...but the MBR itself is just a data
structure...looking at it and understanding it is actually what _DATA
RECOVERY_ people need to do, even if it's also what virus coders look
at as well...

If you're interested in anti-viruses, adding protections to your
system, perhaps wanting to learn more about how to recover data
because you'd like to start moving into that field or something
(someone with noble intentions _has_ to be understanding them too or
anti-viruses and data recovery ain't possible), then MBRs are a force
for _good_, not ill...

> Who cares?

Someone who uses MASM 1.2 cares, obviously...and, again, you presume
far too much about why someone might be asking such questions...

What you're missing is that there are NO stupid questions...there are
only stupid people who presume too much, misunderstand and tend to
mess things up as they go near them...

> So I don't want to get involved with them.

Then this is _your loss_ and your loss _alone_...trust me, with your
attitude, these people are better off without your help and it's
_good_ that you don't pester them...perhaps the only redeeming feature
of arrogance: someone so arrogantly Adores themselves that they
actually tend to leave other people alone...there's good and bad in
everything, after all...

> Then there are certain people who think they are God's gift to the
assembly
> world. They know everything and blindly believe they are an expert,
but when you
> pin them down for specifics, they hem and they haw and they dodge
and evade the
> issue, and continue afterwards as if they didn't notice you exposed
a gaping
> whole in their alleged knowledge. And there is no point in engaging
them except
> for a little fun.

Indeed, that is the _only_ reason why people bothering engaging with
you, Sage...

> And then every once in awhile, you get someone who is honest,
doesn't know
> everything but certainly knows the answer to your one question or
tells you
> something you didn't know before...and it makes it all worth it.
>
> ...and now you know why I frequent here anyway.

Right, that _is_ explained to satisfaction...that is, why you
_frequent_ the group...now, you've only got to explain why you insist
on posting nonsense rather than just sitting tight waiting for that
"every once in a while"...it's quite possible to simply "lurk" and get
this information...what's the compulsion to post up "you are all
stupid and full of logical fallacies" and such, when, usually, all you
cause is grief...in fact, you'd be cutting off your own nose when it
comes to the reason why you _frequent_ this group, as if you ask a
reasonable question, then you've so pissed many people off, then they
don't feel in any way obliged to give you that one honest answer to
your question that you're looking for...

Swings and roundabouts...you scratch my back, I'll scratch
yours...this tends to be the default operating mode of human beings
that, if you're wanting useful honest information, then you've just
got to ask why on Earth you're so intent on rubbing as many people up
the wrong way as possible?

> >Well, that's nice...I do Hope, at some point, though, that you
might
[ snip ]
> >So, please, in more ways than one, leave this group and go use your
> >intellect somewhere where it'll be more useful...
>
> Your advice is well meaning but severly misplaced.

Ummm, no...I was just taking the piss, actually...but, well,
whatever...

> My intellect is used
> *wherever* I go because I never put my brain on hold.

Then perhaps you need a new CPU fan to cool that brain down a bit, as
it appears to be often malfunctioning due to overheating or
something...

> I would hate to meet the
> people you have to make that assumption.

You're presuming yourself...I don't actually believe in those sorts of
separational policy...I repeat, I was simply taking the piss out of
you and having some fun running logical circles around that overheated
little brain of yours...sorry, it's rather cruel to make a sport out
of someone like that but, well, you insist on conduct that simply
makes you of little use to to the group but for this sort of thing...

> >[ I could make suggestions as to where your intellect would prove
most
> >useful but that would only betray the fact that I'm taking the piss
> >out of you royally here with immense sarcasm (sorry, as I say,
that's
> >what us "dunces" do...we know no better, unfortuantely) so I'll
> >refrain from that temptation ;) ]
>
> You are the most polite "dunce" I have ever met, so you failed, but
every
> failure is a stepping stone to success.

That's just gone straight over your head, hasn't it? Cool...as it
whizzs passed your brain, it might generate some breeze to help cool
down the overheating there...try executing a "HLT" during idle
periods...it'll help your hardware last longer, if you relieve the
stress once in a while...after all, that's why I'm bothering to talk
to you myself...a little "distraction"...change as good as a rest and
all that ;)

Beth :)

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