Re: RosAsm disassembler output vs. IDA Pro

From: Beyond2000! (mauroteste_at_hotmail.com)
Date: 01/25/04 

Date: 24 Jan 2004 22:40:03 -0800

Hi Randy,

For the rate i said....The files are being tested randomnly, nobody is
choosing a file to test just to tease you or something with high
rates. The data inside code, data that looks like adrress...those
kinda problems is exactly what René is trying to fix, and he did fix
in some cases.

About the size of the file....Of course that size don't have much
relashionship with the final result, but the tests we are doing is in
all aspects, speed, memory leaks, reliability of the resultant code,
identificatino of nested data etc etc...

"So everyone who uses the disassembler is going to use it to
disassemble
GPL code (for which the source already exists) or code that they own,
right? That's not the impression I got reading Rene's posts. Sorry."

This is the logical and more safer actitude to the user. If the user
disassemble an copyrighted app, he should at least be aware of the
risks of his action. This is the modification of the license i was
talking about.

Ok..a few things....

1 - Yeah...i am a lawyer. And no, i did not graduated at hong
kong...And you don't understood what i tried to explain.

2 - I wouldn't intend to start a war with you. There were no reason
for you being stupid (i mean rude --- dunno the term in english)

3 - What i wrote was not a atach at you, in anyway...If you are in
defensive, just consider that english is not may native language and
it is very dificult for me try to explain legal doutrines (and acts)
to common people, and it is even more dificult to do that in english.

The copyright law is not that simple Randy....Law is not like math. It
always depends on interpretation and facts.

I was not saying in anyway that people are allowed to do whatever they
want with any disassembler.

"It is fair to rip off code from someone else's copyrighted work?"
"Renaming the process doesn't change it in the eyes of the law."
Of course not...but you didn't understood....No disassembler can
actually rip off the code (the original code, i mean). It is not as
simple as you say as only "renaming the process".

Look, nobody here is a defender of illegal actions.

In authoral rights (copyright and patents, in general), there are some
aspects you need to consider. 1st the softwares that are fully
protected by copyright law, i mean, whose licenses prevents the use of
the application other then the one specified by the license. 2nd the
ones that were available for the public (public domain). 3rd the ones
that the user actually owns the license to do whatever he wants,
except sell, rent or distribute the app. 4th - the use of the app to
be studied (Fully or parts of it -- depends of the license). 5th. The
focused people that the app was made to. (I mean...if the app was
build to be used only to and for military people, or university, or
medical staff, etc etc)

When someone builds a license to be used in their apps (or books or
whatever...), he must take into account that is not only because he
registered (I don't know the term in english for that) his app, that
he is fully protected by the copyrigth law. His license must contains
all aspects that he wants to preserve. In general terms, a license is
nothing but a contract. This "contract"
is valid under a preexistent law. The license should be accordying to
the law that he is focused, but, if the "contract" contains some
topics that allows the user to distribute or copy the product, if the
user copy it..it will be perfectly legal. (Of course, that if this
copy doen's harm the rights of others, that were prevented by the
law.)

Randy, it's really a hard thing to explain in english...It is not a
simple as it seems to be.

You are thinking in commercial terms of the subject and this is where
you are not understanding in what i'm trying to say (This and my
inability explain technical law terms in english).

When i gave to you the example of Coca-Cola, i was saying in general
terms...I was not thinking in terms of diferences between patrents and
copyrights etc. I only said that way, because i thought it would be
better for you to understand.

Nobody said in reverse engineer copyrighted apps. I was trying to tell
you that sometimes, what you think that is protected by copyrigth, it
may not be.

"The copyright law covers "translations".
You may no more disassemble a program and legally copy the result
than you could translate "Art of Assembly" into French and sell it
yourself because it is not the same as the original."

This is exactly what i was trying to say. In your case (AOAsm), as
long as you own the license (and i assume you do), nobody can
translate (directly and literally) to any language without your
express permission. This is also valid for websites distributions,
annoucements etc etc.

Here is when i say that you are only thinking in commercial terms and
you are making a small mistake.

If someone buys your book, reads it, learn from it, and...let's
say..in 02 months he decide to write his own book based on what he
learned and read...he is totally able to, as long as he:

1 - Don't wrote his book as an exact or very similar copy of yours;
2 - On any equal of similar terms, he make a note to the origins (a
bibliography notation, i mean)
3 - He didn't use, sell, rent your terms as if they were made by him.
4 - He didn't wrote the title as the same as yours that could cause
confusion to the consumer.
5 - He wrote the book based on his own arguments, conclusions
etc...developing a new idea, even if he is talking about your subject.
(Not as he made your subject as his, of course)

For softwares, is not exactly the same thing as the books....but the
rules are similar.

In a much, much simpler way...what makes it legal are 02 things: a)
The attention to the law where the software was builded (or patented
or copyrighted); b) The respect of the usage of the license of the app

I won't make further comments about your offenses about me, Randy.
Only thought that you were able to understand what i was trying to
say, in a friendly way...but...you are so disturbed and involved with
these flame wars...that again i have to say...You don't get it !

"Call me all the names you want. Like that's going to bother me after
what
I've put up with from Rene over the past four years (and many people
before that)."

You are being too emotive here....I thought you knew that it was a
inofensive teasement. But perhaps, since René is not the only one who
you are puting up with, and at least 04 years ago you had problems
with other people...well, this may explain your acts.

"In the end, however, I feel sorry that you're going to have to learn
these lessons the hard way. It's too bad that *you're* not willing to
take
a lesson from a teacher and you're following the path set down by
someone who *clearly* isn't a teacher."

What lesson ? Really, i didn't understood...what kinda lesson ?

Sorry Randy if all of this upset you, i was not trying to push my
point of view or something...only trying to explain a couple of
things.

Best regards,

Guga

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