Re: Computer time -> Developer time -> User time?
From: The /\\\\o//\\annabee (Faq(Sqeeeek!)_at_.@szmyggenpv.com)
Date: 01/22/05
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Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2005 12:44:18 +0100
På Sat, 22 Jan 2005 11:01:54 +0100, skrev Herbert Kleebauer
<klee@unibwm.de>:
> Beth wrote:
>
>> So, like the other illogical critics, what is your _REAL_ argument? If
>> it's
>
> All I can say is:
>
> ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
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> ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
Hehe. Funny. Nevertheless. Your statements that asm is not useful for
fulltime productions by mediocre programmers is simply wrong. And proven
wrong, btw (by me). Asm would be the best language for any form of
programming, and it would make C-class programmers (as you call it) become
better programmers as well. It did this to me. It would make us all better
programmers. And it would mean that applications written by theese
programmers would become much faster, better, much more maintainable and
in all possible senses better. And I mean better, than what that
programmer would do earlier. So I speak relatively, to this programmers
(mine) earlier achivements, not absolute. Asm programming is simply
easier. When it comes to devicing good solutions, or of beeing less lazy
and etc, this is sideissues, and diffrent between programmers. I am
terrible lazy, and could certainly learn to spend more time with each
problem, but still asm is much better suited for my work.
VB was, back when I tried it, USELESS. Delphi, is not useless, but
compared to RosAsm its a laughing matter, or at least a terrible choice,
when given RosAsm on the other hand. I would argue C, or at least C++ to
be about equal to Delphi in this regard. Actually from an OOP only
viewpoint, they are simply identical.
Your maintainance claim is completly wrong. This has to do with
organization on the programmer, and nothing todo with language. It could
have something, but not much, todo with selection of tools.
But I claim that it has todo with experience, and with the sizes of
project you had to maintain. If you ever needed to write singlehandedly a
large project, so large, that you could not in any way estimate the size
at the outset, and maybe didnt know how to implement it, then you will by
experience teach yourself to have some sort of order. You know, if you
read about programming, in journals and etc, there have been many voiced
strategies for how to become a better programmer, like for instance
Xtreme-programming. Voiced by HLL programmers. Why ? Because current
strategies fail, again and again.
It maybe, that you yourself, are some genious, and a star-programmer, but
this doesnt mean everybody is. Asm will help all "less"
experienced/talented programmers become seriously better programmers.
If you still claim that asm is useless for huge projects, then I be happy
to try prove you wrong. Since january last year, I have spent maybe a
total of 5 months on my code. Maybe even less. I am terribly lazy at the
moment (not fully healthy). But still I am now allready half the way to my
goal. I know for 100% sure that I am way less experienced than many
programmers, and way less smart than many, and I can still do it.
Heres a link to my current work :
http://www.szmyggenpv.com/downloads/MMEXBlue.Zip
and here :
http://www.szmyggenpv.com/downloads/CurrentProject.Zip
Each day i add, remove & change code, and find new bugs and fix them. Its
far from bugfree yet, and far from best code, but still useful, and should
at least give you the clue you need that full asm production is fully
possible, even for hobbylevel programmers.
This is very verbose code. about 6 times as verbose as plain asm, due to
use of extremly long labels. (A bad newbie choise actually). The code is
about a megabyte. I have absolutly null problem myself, finding and
reusing the code. The CurrentProject is just copied to a new exe, and then
I add what I need for the new functionality. When I am settled, I remove
unused code using the unused_symbol scanner in the compilation status
dialog.
This has sofar worked pretty well for me I think. So than it would work
even better for better programmers.
To see some (one _day_ work, + scanning later) take a look at theese apps.
http://www.szmyggenpv.com/downloads/DiskFree.Zip
http://www.szmyggenpv.com/downloads/RebootWindows.Zip
Theese two wore written in one day, reusing code from the StartUp called
CurrentProject.
The reason why the code is so big, is that it include its own GUI, and do
not use any of windows own gui functionality, except for the needed
window. Also, some parts of the code is disabled because of setbacks
needed to fix bugs that where discovered later.
I know for sure, that theese projects will grow, assuming my health stays
somewhat good. And I know for sure, that they are no less maintainable now
than at the outset. In fact they are more maintainable now.
- Next message: Vic Drastik: "Re: this is the time to pray"
- Previous message: Betov: "Re: this is the time to pray"
- In reply to: Herbert Kleebauer: "Re: Computer time -> Developer time -> User time?"
- Next in thread: Herbert Kleebauer: "Re: Computer time -> Developer time -> User time?"
- Reply: Herbert Kleebauer: "Re: Computer time -> Developer time -> User time?"
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