Re: When caveman Uhg invented fire


sevagK wrote:
¬a\/b wrote:
On 6 Apr 2006 16:56:44 -0700, "Dragontamer" wrote:

I disagree actually; hate to be the first to do so.

Merchants/Industry today provide the tools necessary for the hobby to
create
new works. Frankly speaking, without the merchants/industry, we
wouldn't
have the computers built for us. And take it one step further, without
someone
selling the rouge computer parts to early hobbists, they wouldn't have
been
able to even build a computer.

but the aim for Merchants/Industry is "money" and *for money* they can
use the power of inventions for kill us all. (e.g. atomic bobs or
other that is an invention of many [e.g. OGM (we don't know enough)])
more there is technology power, more there is the need of reflection
on what to use and the correct reason why use.
it could be for good or for destroy

The aim is closer to "ownership". Useful tools used as weapons are the
owners' way of protecting their inventory.
The ultimate goal is for one person to own *everything* and everybody
else to own nothing except what the ultimate owner leases to them.

However, it usually doesn't get that far. For one, the system is
regulated to some degree (for now), and when the ratio of
owners/leasers (let's call them masters/slaves) get to a breaking
point... say around 6 slaves for every one master, there is a slave
revolt, the master's get their heads chopped off and the cycle repeats.

Yet, each new generation of masters learns from the previous master's
mistakes and becomes more formidable. They learn ways to make the
slaves compliant and give them an illusion of freedom. One popular
illusion is called "Democracy." No matter how or for whome you 'vote',
the masters will still get what they want while occasionally throwing
the voters a bone to keep the illusion alive. Other popular tactics
include making slaves into "little masters" ... let them have ownership
of small insignificant baubels and another is to cause the slave to
become dependent on needless products by creating the illusion of
'need'.

The true "hobbyist" is one who feels that there is something wrong
with this merry-go-round and want's to step off, but realizes that
doing so will cause him to fall and get trampled to death, so he just
sticks out an arm or a leg.

O.o

Wow. Lots of hate going round for the simple Business owner. Overall, I
see
your point, but it forces you to see Business owners and other leaders
in the world as ultimate evil.

Your entire point falls on this: that there is no "choice" in life.

And that is too sad and pessimistic a choice for me to see. If you
don't like
being someone's "slave" for a living, then become a business owner.
Bill Gates
started somewhere, McDonalds started somewhere. And if you think that
there is only one way to make money, you are sooooo dead wrong. Most
people
are so intent on making inventions (aka, new computer programs) that
they
see that as the only way of making money.

Case in point: you can always say no. You never have to accept a job
today,
you don't have to join a union, you can vote for someone else if you
don't like
anyone.

Frankly speaking: this "hobbiest" you talk about is simply a lazy bum
who "wants"
to change the world, but can't see the world as anything else. He is
scared
to work. Either that, or blinded by his pessimistic views of the world.

Case in point: don't like presidential candidates? Do you know how
*long* you
can change the outcome of presidential elections? The 2008 election
cycle
starts in 2005, maybe earlier as candidates start rallying people for
the
primary elections. Right now is probably too late to change the 2008
elections,
but you still have influence over it. You can still choose from about a
dozen people
to support in the upcomming primary elections.

It isn't that you can't change an election, it is that people think
they can't change the
election by 2008 cause they don't want to work for it. Of course you
can't
change the polls by November 2008, your only choice there is the
Democrat or
the Republican.

But right *now*, now is the time when the elections get decided.

Another case: Businesses and their products. Don't like Microsoft's
products?
Then make your own! Don't like what Microsoft does with your money?
Don't
buy? Use a Mac! Use Linux. Build your own OS. Use BSD, or BeOS.

Don't like Intel? Use any other chip, MIPS, or those PowerPC chips.

Don't like any of them? Don't use a computer. Quite simple, isn't it?

Or maybe, you can build your own architecture.

You only rely on computers because you rely on them. Amish folk seem to
work
well without them, why can't you?

Spending too much time making your OS that you can't go to work? Get a
business license and sell your OS. Release it as Open Source, GPL, BSD,
whatever you want. Build off of Linux or BSD.

Sell it to the hair-cutter down the street who is pissed off because
Microsoft
doesn't make any products, and IBM and other companies don't make
programs
for store clerks. Use Linux as a base as the guys at TVO did and make
specialized
fast running software for him on a custom version of Linux. (or BSD if
you don't like
the Linux code/license) Hell, do it with Menuet OS and Fasm cause you
guys are
such assembly gurus.

Because it is specialized, you can make a hardware driver that sends
radio waves to little gizmos that get set off upto a mile away and tell
the
people when the hair-cuttery is empty so they can come in and get their
hair
cut right away.

And no, you don't have to do it with a hair cutter. Ski-shop owner
keeps
getting his computers wet and they keep dieing. Make a specilized
computer
that works underwater for him that does the above. Etc. Etc.

------------------

Enough hypothetical, how about something real so you guys can
believe me. An honest man I know got together with his buddies,
raised some money and bought a X-Ray machine (or something
along those lines). In my State, it is illegal for doctors to own
X-Ray machines (good reason why, else everyone would give $200
in X-Ray fees "just in case" with that doctor)

So now, he rents the X-Ray machine out to doctors in my area, and
actually was able to sell the X-Ray machine to someone else, while
now renting it and leasing it to the doctors.

He did the same thing with 3d-printers as well, except he didn't buy
a 3d-printer. He just rents a machine he is renting out to other
people.

And he works at a 9-to-5 job during the day, as he really doesn't need
to
do much other than collect rent on machines he doesn't own.

The owner of the X-Ray is happy: else he wouldn't have bought the
XRay in the first place, not to mention, is collecting a major source
of rent from the first guy.

The Doctors are happy; they got a cheap source of X-Rays for their
patients.

Owners of the 3d printer are happy; they are making money on their
$300,000
investment that they only use personally for 1 hour every month or so.

Other Engineers using the 3d printer are happy, they can use a
3d-printer
without spending $300,000.

And that guy I mentioned is happy. He is literally making money as he
sleeps.
(He doesn't need to maintain the XRay machine nor the 3-D printer)
------------------

Basically:
My respect goes to the business owners, who worked their butts
off changing the world while your "hobbiests" were too busy
complaining.

--Dragontamer

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