Re: Any comments? (Answers to Pete)

Pete Dashwood wrote:

[much snippage - one > is Pete, two is me, etc.]

I don't think it's insecurity at all - it's just that, because He is Who He is, He demands it.

That is my point, Daniel. Demanding it is not the action of one who understands real power. You don't demand respect, you earn it.

Sure, we as people feel that way - but, then again, we aren't God. If you are the absolute, one and only Creator of the Universe, aren't you entitled to demand respect if your uppity creations don't give it on their own?

Back to Jesus - He was conceived by the Holy Spirit inside a virgin - so, although He was human in form, He did *not* have the sin nature that all other men (as in "mankind") are born with. So, yes - He didn't sleep with Mary Magdalene, or lie to his parents, or play hooky from school, or steal apples.

You must understand how hard it is for me to accept the Virgin Birth argument (given that science requires a cloned offspring from a woman to be female), but, going along with it for the moment, even if he didn't have the propensity to sin that the rest of us have, that would not preclude him from taking the opportunity. If MM offered herself on plate as it were and he wasn't gay, wouldn't he be simply following human nature like he was supposed to?

Yes - and that's the point. Human nature is inherently sinful. If she did, and He did *not* partake, that squares with Hebrews 4:15b - "but [He] was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin."

I definitely agree on your last statement above. Let me ask you this - how is evangelical Christianity treated in New Zealand?

People are free to practise their religion. We have a diverse society and there is a Kiwi attitude that says people should be given a "fair go". If you start sacrificing goats on your front lawn in the name of your religion, you can expect complaints from your neighbours. If you don't desist, there will be a visit form the cops and you will probably be charged with cruelty to animals, running an unlicensed abbatoir, failure to comply with Public Health and Safety regulations or some other Civil statute that protects your neighbours from having to put up with it. You can scream "Freedom of Religion" all you like, the State has precedence.

What's the COBOL market like over there? ;)

Are cities allowed to put up Christmas trees without the threat of lawsuit?

As far as I know. They have one in Tauranga.

And they're called "Christmas Trees"? Cool. (Of course, it would be a *real* switch to celebrate Christmas on December 25th - in the middle of summer!)

Are Bible clubs allowed in public high schools, and afforded the same privileges as the chess club or the debate club?

Yes. At least at the schools I attended. (None of which were 'religious' schools.)

Excellent.

Are people who object to lewd behavior labeled as "prudes" and "Bible-thumpers"?

If they ARE prudes and Bible thumpers :-)

Heh - that was Richard's reply as well. At least Kiwis are consistent! :)

I suspect that some other countries may actually have greater freedom of religion that the good ol' US of A does these days...

Maybe other countries don't work so hard at it...

Hard work at taking it away requires hard work at keeping it. I'd love the forces at work in this country to stop trying to sanitize our heritage and our culture. But, when you've got folks suing to eliminate things that have been in our country for over 200 years, not "working hard at it" isn't an option.

That sounds great - now define rehabilitation. Is taking them off the streets for a time rehabilitation?

No, rehabilitation is getting them to realise that if they are to live in a society, they have to respect their fellow citizens and treat them right. Rehabilitation means they lose the urge to be anti-social.

[snip]

As I expected, very reasoned. :)

Believe it or not, but in a 'humane and civilized' society, these crimes simply would not occur.

I wholeheartedly agree. But why are things getting worse instead of getting better - are that many people rebelling against human nature? Or is human nature "naturally" depraved?

OK, I dodged your question... here's what I think:

Anyone who commits sexual crimes against children and women... or murders innocent people by acts of terrorism: Cut their arms and legs off and leave them on street corners for people to kick as they walk past...

Sounds good to me....

No?

I'm sure someone would object...

OK then... removal permanently from civilized society by means of a painless and humane injection.(Checks and balances in place to ensure there is no doubt of guilt whatsoever. If there is doubt, then they get a long prison sentence that can be shortened depending on their progress towards rehabilitation.) In all cases, including execution, full reparation to be made to the victims (if alive) or their families. Executed criminals have all of their worldly wealth distributed back to the victim's family.

That last part should be part of every nation's code.

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