Re: OT:Thanksgiving

Pete Dashwood wrote:
By all means punish felons (you guys seem Hell-bent on doing so...
for all the good it does...), but once someone pays their debt to
society, they shouldn't be marked as a second-class citizen for the
rest of their life.

They were second-class citizens to begin with. They chose their life, they
picked their actions knowing the consequence.


I was watching one of those cop video documentaries on free-to-air TV
here tonight and I thought some of the police treatment was apalling.
It was all from the USA. I realise miscreants are likely to carry
guns and police need protection, but some of what went on was
definitely excessive...

You should understand that in most jurisdictions, the police chief is a
political appointment and does NOT represent the attitudes or priorities of
the officers of the department. Below we have an example, from just
yesterday, of a political police chief firing a long-time officer for
obviously political reasons.

Money quote:
"I paused and hesitated, especially because he was facedown and on the
ground, before making the decision to shoot several more rounds to ensure I
ended the threat."
http://www.statesman.com/news/content/news/stories/local/11/29/1129olsen.html

Note in this case - as in so many others - the goblin was a person of color
and the officer was a person of pallor. There are canned phrases among the,
um, enlightened. You never, NEVER, "shoot to kill" or "shoot to wound" or
"shoot to warn." You always, ALWAYS "shoot to end the threat." An officer
has drummed into him that he must use that phrase to the exclusion of all
others.

You see, there's cop-speak and citizen-speak. I remember a TV show where a
cop was being interrogated after he killed a squint. The investigating
officer finally summed up the two-hour interview with: "Okay, you say you
identified yourself as an officer and the suspect ran to the bedroom and
opened a dresser drawer. From the drawer he drew a large-caliber firearm and
pointed it in your direction. You, being in fear for your life, discharged
your service weapon. Is that your statement?"

"Yeah. Like I told you, he went for his piece and I smoked him."

Anyway, I spoke to one Austin officer (via email) today and he says the
entire department is steamed about the raw deal the chief handed the
sergeant, just for killing a goblin.


A burglar had a police dog set on him. Fair enough. But the handler
didn't call the dog off once the guy had given up. Instead he let the
dog seriously maul the guy, ignored the victim's screams of
surrender, then rewarded the dog with "Good Boy...". I found it
sickening and an abuse of power.

The perps know the cops have dogs. The perps know the cops have guns. They
willingly take their chances. Who are we to deny them their freedom to
choose?


I am not a bleeding heart Liberal who would scream "police brutality"
if someone genuinely resisted arrest, but neither do I think that
when someone has surrendered they should be shot or savaged by a dog.

Surrender? There is no surrender in police work.


There are calls for the police here to be armed (currently, they are
not) and they are currently trialing tasers, amidst divided public
opinion. After watching this program, I've changed my mind on issuing
tasers (I was in favour, but I realise that if you give someone a
toy, they can't wait to use it...there have already been misuses of
pepper spray by police here...)

Ah yes, the "Twitch Patrol" ("Light 'em up. Move 'em out. Rawhide!"). Many
cops embrace the use of Tasers because no sane person likes to touch that
stuff with their hands.


I guess the bottom line on what I'm saying here is that if you view
criminals as a sub-human, sub-culture, treat them brutally, and
remove any hope of them ever being being able to lead a normal life,
you shouldn't be too surprised at what you get.

Hold on. Criminals are not treated as sub-human until they demonstrate that
they ARE sub-human. They are not catagorized as being part of a degenerate
sub-culture until they act like they are part of a degerate sub-culture.
They have not been leading a normal life when they came into contact with
the rest of society in the first place. And, speaking as an ex-cop, we are
not surprised at the depravity to which some can descend. And that descent
was NOT of society's making.


If you see them as fellow human beings, citizens of your country, who
have screwed up, accord them the same respect you would any other
person, you might get a different type of criminal. At the very least
you could be proud of your Police Force and your Society.

Treat them as any other person? Respect them? See them as fellow human
beings? "Well, yes, you chopped up a small child, but that's behind you now.
Would like some tea and biscuits?" No, they have lost - or never had - those
qualities that make them a human being. It's insanity to hold otherwise.



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