Re: OT:Thanksgiving

On Mon, 3 Dec 2007 15:33:58 -0600, "Judson McClendon" <judmc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

"Robert" <no@xxxxxx> wrote:
"HeyBub" <heybub@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Robert wrote:

Explain why the murder rate in non-penalty states is 40% lower than
the rate in death penalty states -- 4.22 versus 5.9 per 100K
population.

http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/article.php?scid=12&did=168
http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/article.php?did=169

You may have it backwards; because the murder rate is so high, those states
are doing everything they can to discourage killing, including
disenfranchisement.

This is called circular logic. The conclusion is supposed to follow from the premise, not
the other way around.

I say smoking prevents lung cancer. When you ask me to explain why smokers get more of it,
I answer look how much more cancer there would be if they didn't smoke. That proves I was
right.

Fallacious logic; you are leaving out intent and Occam's Razor. People
pass laws to address problems. Laws were passed to disenfranchise
felons for the same reason felons are incarcerated: to reduce crime.

"Voting is linked with reduced recidivism; one study shows that 27 percent of non-voters
were rearrested, compared with 12 percent of voters."

Source: King, Ryan S., "A Decade of Reform: Felony Disenfranchisement Policy in the
United States" (Washington, DC: Sentencing Project, 2006), p. 2.

Disenfranchising felons doesn't decrease crime; it increases crime by reinforcing the
criminal's feeling that society is inequitible and refusing to share power.

Prisons don't reduce crime any more than Band-Aids reduce cuts. Both are after the fact
damage control. Reducing crime requires eliminating root causes. People become criminals
when their emotional, intellectual or physical resources are unable to meet the challenges
of their economic and social environment. Unsurmoutable challenges come from dysfunctional
parents, learning disorders, racial prejudice, lack of employment opportunities, and
feeling excluded from the community. The last is why high crime occurs in places with many
transients and new arrivals.

It is not logical to assume the laws were simply passed, then people became
more felonious, because you then have to come up with a reason for them
becoming more felonious. I.e. violation of Occam's Razor.

They become more feloneous when laws are changed to redefine petty crime as felony.

"In 1986, before mandatory minimums for crack offenses became effective, the average
federal drug offense sentence for blacks was 11% higher than for whites. Four years later
following the implementation of harsher drug sentencing laws, the average federal drug
offense sentence was 49% higher for blacks."

"There were an estimated 9.9 million whites (72 percent of all users), 2.0 million blacks
(15 percent), and 1.4 million Hispanics (10 percent) who were current illicit drug users
in 1998. And yet, blacks constitute 36.8% of those arrested for drug violations, over 42%
of those in federal prisons for drug violations. African-Americans comprise almost 58% of
those in state prisons for drug felonies; Hispanics account for 20.7%."

"One in three black men between the ages of 20 and 29 years old is under correctional
supervision or control."

http://www.drugwarfacts.org/racepris.htm
.

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