Re: I'd RTFM if they actually GAVE me a FM!!

From: Raptor (bogus_at_none.com)
Date: 02/18/05 

Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 14:43:29 -0800

Genome <ilike_spam@yahoo.co.uk> wrote

> > > First time I came around you told me to RTFG..... Read The Fucking
> > > Google.
> >
> > If it was me, I probably phrased it more delicately. All I've ever said
> > is that Google usually gives an answer quicker than the so-called
> > documentation, and that's quite often true for Borland's docs as well.
> >
>
> Well, you used RTFM.

No, I did not. I said, in the entirety:

"I suggest you Google the web for 'delphi tutorial.' The stuff you're asking
about sounds as basic as you can get, not much more than the traditional
'Hello, world' programs, and you should be willing to look that up on your
own.

"If you get stuck on a particular and are unable to get past it, a specific
question might get a response, but you should begin with the tutorials."

Making forms appear and disappear is very basic, and usually addressed in
principle early in tutorials. You're reading a harshness into that which was
never intended, nor, so far as I can tell, is there even unintentionally. I
don't think I've ever summarily told anyone else to RTFM. Not my style.

> I accept that you might be having problems the the
> manuals existance..... but. The help file, and the Google.... are looking
> for the words that explain the problem to find the solution.
>
> It also involves my 'brane' which don't necessarily think the same way.
>
> > The old-timers here appreciate queries when noobs have at least tried to
> > find the answer elsewhere. What annoys them are folks who are looking
for
> > others to do their work for them.
> >
> And I did say I might have deserved your response.

Deserved-schmeserved. I just suggested a tutorial and tried to prepare you
for the possibility that you may fail to get a response for so basic a
question. As it was, someone generously answered in detail.

[...]

> > To explain the difference between a function and a procedure.
>
> Cough! Kick me around the head a bit. I don't know the difference.

That's no disgrace. But there are limits to how elementary even **I** would
have documentation be. Some things belong in elementary tutorials and some
things belong in advanced documentation. The question that writers of such
things need to ask themselves is: What can I reasonably expect the average
user of this material to understand without further clarification?

The answer for basic tutorials is "almost nothing." The answer for more
advanced components is "most of the basics but few specialized terms and the
specifics of use."

Big difference.

[...]

> > > So you learned their language?
> >
> > Eventually one does. The issue is whether a product makes it easy or
> > difficult.
>
> Which is/was kind of what I was saying.

You took my suggestion to Google for a tutorial far too personally and far
too critically. It was good advice. I perceived you as one who lacked the
basics, which you've confirmed by saying you don't know the difference
between a function and a procedure.

You may find someone to explain it on this NG, but a far better use of your
time (and theirs) might be to read a tutorial.

> > > Seems to me........
> >
> > I'm not quite sure just what it seems to you. What are you trying to
> > say?
> >
>
> Sometimes, you suffer as well?

I suggested you Google for information. That's good advice. I do it all the
time. You are perceiving some condescension in my reply to you that was
simply not intended. If someone said to me, "here's a good tutorial on
try/finally/except" I'd nominate them for sainthood!

We're all ignorant and don't know how to frame our questions sometimes.
We're just ignorant about different things, to different degrees. I suggest
you lose the sensitivity--if you hang around newsgroups long enough you'll
encounter GENUINELY crusty and arrogant, contemptuous bastards, and they
won't care in the least about your feelings.

Raptor