Re: What I Think Delphi Needs to Do to Survive


"Chris Burrows" <cfbsoftware@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:4414c344$1@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
"Dan Barclay" <Dan@xxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:4414af9f$1@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

The downside with VB at this point isn't the language, it's that MS keeps
changing the behavior and definition of the language syntax. That's
downright scary, and a number of us who have used it for years are
leaving it behind for that single reason.


If you are still developing forWin32 world you wouldn't worry would you?
AFAIK Win32 VB syntax hasn't changed has it?

Nope, the syntax hasn't changed. We're still doing some of our app in VB,
some in Delphi. Moving to Delphi over the long run (no "panic" conversion
going on).

Looking at the long term VB will die. It'll take a while, but it will. Any
apps doing anything complex are in trouble in the long term. Those using
3rd party controls are toast sooner.

We look at our business, and therefore our applications, in the very long
term. Not doing so is asking for trouble down the line. We intend to use
our core library code in all the environments we support, and doing that
with VB is not possible.

To take full advantage of the .NET world and to be able to interact most
easily with other languages some changes had to be made. Changes can be
painful in the short term but without any change there can be no progress.

Actually that's *not* true, though it's prevelant in the MS marketeer FUD.
The developers know better, and have said so. The changes made in VB were
made to "clean up" the language (quoting the MS development team). Only one
primary issue, deterministic finalization, was required by .Net. Even that
could be accomodated but I take that change as valid. All the others were
language cleansing. Rote changes with *no* deprecation. You can put your
code there, but I'm done with it.

FWIW, the above isn't speculation. It's fact. If you don't believe me you
can ask the VB development team yourself, which I have done face to face.
I've been involved with (making a living with) MSBasic since CP/M and TRSDOS
versions. I was in the first group of VB MVP's when the MVP program was
created in 1993. I know what's up.

BTW, you wouldn't believe what some of the dev team would like to do with
VB.Net going forward. If you think they're through "cleaning up" then you
might want to pay close attention to the approach and attitude of the dev
team.

If you don't buy that argument, look at in another way - Microsoft has
done you a favour if it has forced you to open your eyes to other
possibilities.

<groan> I'd have to be overwhelmed by PollyAnnaism to buy into that. OTOH,
one of the folks MS had in their focus groups looking at this seems to need
MS to tell him when to rewrite:

"Drop backward compatibility altogether. Do us a favor; haven't you guys
learned the lesson of DOS? Backward compatibility cost us so much money over
the years. Break my code. Force me into getting rid of my old code if I want
to add VB7 features into my product."

That quote, among many others, found here with links to its reference
source:
http://vb.mvps.org/vfred/Trust.asp
click on the reference link, check pg 7 of the interview.

That's a fine approach if you're writing throw away (temporary) code, or if
you're a consultant. Not much good for owners of the applications:
http://vb.mvps.org/tips/stability.asp

BTW, I *still* like the MSBasic language best for what I'm doing. My
decision to leave it behind is not based on a dislike of the language, but
on business requirements. My code assets are valuable and I'm not going to
let MS wreck them.

Dan
MS VB MVP 1993-2001
VB R.I.P


.

Relevant Pages

  • Re: Implicit object constructor misinterpretation
    ... specified for the language that is being parsed. ... sub-set of the syntax for object literals. ... document that will teach anyone how to program with javascript. ... Consider the issue in your OP; you can speculate about "broken switch-case" or "not a constructor but a block of statements", but an examination of the spec shows that the observed behaviour corresponds with the specified behaviour, and explains the specified behaviour. ...
    (comp.lang.javascript)
  • Re: What is this code doing?
    ... Using the same syntax for most statements helps make the ... add, ebx); ... Instruction composition readability is another reason ... Jim Neil's Terse language). ...
    (alt.lang.asm)
  • Re: New bytecode assembly language to play with
    ... language that looks familiar, something I could probably figure out quite ... about a bit of superficial syntax here. ... The wheel has been reinvented several times. ... one that introduces new functionality, i.e. it's not just another way ...
    (comp.lang.misc)
  • Re: Working on new language
    ... I'll make sure to put some warts in the language:) ... syntax to me is misguided. ... So apart from the "so" keyword mentioned below I require ... It would be possible to separate arguments with commas, but the opens ...
    (comp.lang.misc)
  • Re: 10 ten things any good programmer can/has done?
    ... To quote Shriram Krishnamurthi, syntax ... > stress issues other than the surface syntax of some programming language. ... It means that more time has to be spend teaching the ...
    (comp.programming)
Loading