Re: debate: to get a Master's Degree in CS or Not

Walter Bright wrote:
> "slebetman@xxxxxxxxx" <slebetman@xxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
> news:1136338567.301629.41380@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>
>>Walter Bright wrote:
>>
>>><xtcsonik@xxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
>>>news:1136303521.497809.262100@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>
>>>>I am currently a Microsoft .NET developer. I've been considering the
>>>>costs/benefits of enrolling in a graduate degree at a local university.
>>>>I got my BA in computer science in 2002.
>>>>
>>>><snip>
>>>>
>>>>Any comments or suggestions?
>>>
>>>Make sure you take solid calculus courses. Calculus is the key to the
>>>kingdom, be it science, engineering, programming, economics, etc. The
>>>rest
>>>can be picked up on the job <g>.
>>
>>Funny, I took a computer engineering degree to avoid maths.
>
>
> All I can do is sadly shake my head. The difference between an engineer and
> a tradesman/technician/mechanic is the former knows the math.

I would have said that the difference lies not with what they know but
what they do. These are professions, not identities.

In fact, few engineers have a deep understanding of the pragmatics in
building, pricing, marketing, and selling a thing. Often tradesmen do.
Knowing math has value, but only if it's necessary to what you do.

Math skills are largely irrelevant in all but design. Sure, they are
also useful in optimization practices of all kinds, but from what I've
seen in several decades of working in the world, few organizations care
about efficiency much less optimality. Neither ever got a product
funded or a company built. Ergo, math skills take a distant second to
skills of a more social or practical nature.

>
> So what use is math to a programmer? On the obvious side, it enables one to
> understand *why* one random number generator is better than another. Or why
> one crypto security technique isn't secure. Or how to write models of things
> (game programming comes to mind). Or to understand the strengths/weaknesses
> of various trig implementations, and when they give usable results and when
> they don't.

Sort of. In fact, only the very best mathematicians can determine
whether a crypto algorithm is secure or whether a randomization
algorithm is uniform and ergodic. And math skills are no measure at all
of whether someone can implement these algorithms well or correctly.

Not that I believe math skills are unnecessary or valueless in
computing, but I do think that it's a pretty small fraction of software
jobs that can employ even calculus, much less number theory, abstract
algebra, topology, analysis, or math (or logic) proofs of any kind.

Statistics is another matter. All that you say in defense of math I
would agree more to in defense of statistics. And where higher math is
necessary in order to further one's understanding of statistics, I would
agree that math skills add practical value. In practice, stats may not
be that much more useful than math in most computing jobs, but I think
it could and should be.

>
> On a more subtle level, mastering math teaches the mind to think a certain
> way, a way that fits in very well with programming. I now and then run into
> programmers who are unable to figure out why their own programs don't work,
> and in working on them with the problem, they just don't think about the
> problem in an organized way, and have no hope of solving it on their own.
> This kind of skill is what the more challenging math classes will provide
> you.

But that's true for any rigorous subject. Philosophy, law, any form of
science -- all of these teach critical methodical thinking. IMHO, their
mastery is just as valuable to a programmer as math, and perhaps more so
since they deal in values and processes, not just symbols and abstract
relations.

Randy

--
Randy Crawford http://www.ruf.rice.edu/~rand rand AT rice DOT edu
.

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