Re: Brian Kernighan, maybe I'm not worthy, maybe I'm scum

spinoza1111 said:

On Jan 1, 5:12 am, Richard Heathfield <r...@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

An incredible example of poor sportsmanship

Rubbish. You posted a broken test. It has no relevance. The 80% is
meaningless, as is your 76% and Randy's score.

<snip>

I've already shown that you picked a lousy test, and
that a competent C++ programmer would have chosen a better one.

Excuse me, Mr. Heathfield. Real programmers, competent or incompetent,
don't get to choose their tests or their problems.

Remember the sociology test I posted? Stupid, right? No right answer,
right? When there is no right answer, there is no merit in indulging the
test-setter by producing a wrong answer. The proper course is to reject
the question.

The rules of C++ are not defined by me or you but by ISO.

They are defined only in part by ISO. They are also defined in praxis.
The poor workman blames his tools and the test.

No, the poor workman chose a lousy test, and doesn't understand the concept
of a language definition.

Still, to be fair to
all, we need to all accept these tests as final

No, we don't need to do any such thing. The test is broken. It is
inadequate for measuring knowledge of C++, let alone skill in using C++.

I don't know about that.

Evidently. But those who have a basic understanding of the language will
realise that the test is broken in many ways.

But what is more significant is that in your
disappointment at your results, you blame everyone but yourself and
continue cyberbullying.

Disappointment? I *knew* I would score low, because I refused to provide
answers to several of the questions. Disappointment is not the issue here,
as any competent C++ programmer will recognise (because they'll have
observed the same problems with the test that I did, and indeed an expert
C++ programmer would probably have noticed *more* issues than I did).

<snip>

Question 8 is broken. All of the suggested answers except A exhibit
undefined behviour, and answer A modifies the value of x. There is no
correct answer.

(A) x++;
(B) x += x--;
(C) x = x++;
(D) x = --x + 1;

The correct answer is D, and neither it nor any question exhibits
undefined behavior in C++, or in usable C compilers.

Wrong. See ISO/IEC 14882:1998 5(4): [...]

Bull***.

Go tell ISO.

<snip>

Richard, am I missing something?

Yes - you are missing a basic understanding of C++.

A reply from someone who only scored 80% in a beginner's test

Pick a number at random in the range 0-50. Multiply by 2. Now crow about
how big a number you got or weep about how small a number you got. The
test was written by a beginner. The scores are meaningless.

in an
area in which he claims advanced competence,

I have never claimed advanced competence in C++.

Question 10 fails to account for pointer comparison, but is otherwise
trivial.

In C and C++, pointers are integers and as such compareable

No, in neither C nor C++ are pointers integers. They can be converted to
integers, but this conversion is not guaranteed to be lossless.

Your images of C and C++ are intentionally blurred

Go tell ISO. Their images must be intentionally blurred too.

<lots of verbiage snipped - more of the same, basically>

But the competing
answer uses an OR (hope you noticed)

No, in all honesty I missed that. Had I noticed, I would have said that
there was no answer that I could consider correct.

Thank you for your honesty: but in my book a professional programmer
sees immediately the difference between && and || in multiple
languages,

I have addressed this elsethread.

<snip>

The question is incorrect because it claims that sqrt is defined in
math.h, which is false. Only a very broken implementation would put a
definition of the sqrt function in math.h. [...]

You obviously learned programming on your own, and never troubled to
inform yourself about CS 101 whether at uni or by checking a book out
of the library.

Why on EARTH should a simple, usable implementation of sqrt not be
static?

Because it's a stupid idea - inefficient and bloaty, that's why.

<snip>

Question 32 has no correct answer.

No, creating a struct is similar to creating a class.

That wasn't one of the available answers. They were:

(A) is similar to creating a class without member functions

But C++ structs can indeed have member functions, so this answer is
wrong.

OK, I didn't know that

Sheesh.

(C Sharp structs can declare member functions).

I believe that the teacher who created the Spark Notes material is a
better C++ programmer than you,

You don't know C++ well enough to judge that. But on the evidence of the
test, he should be learning C++, not teaching it.

I now see I was wrong. Very well: perhaps the courts shall decide this
after all.

Usenet is packed with evidence of your incompetence and evidence of your
libels against me. If you want to risk a court case, that's your decision.

You may see some value in giving incorrect answers just to please a test
marker, but I don't.

There's no one to please.

True enough - so there's even less reason to supply incorrect answers.

There is only a basic decency and
sportsmanship, a love of the game,

QuestionMaster: "Ladies and gentlemen, we introduce you to: the Stupid
Quiz! As you know, in the Stupid Quiz, we ask you questions which may or
may not have a rational answer, and then we give you some answers to
choose from, and those answers may or may not include the right answer (if
there is one)! And you will show your decency and sportsmanship by putting
up with this brain-damaged nonsense, for the love of the game! Isn't this
fun! Okay - who's our first contestant? ... Oh. Be like that, then."

Producer: "Maybe we could do a sit-com instead?"

I'm not going to do that with the questions you got wrong.

Let's do a little test, with just one question.

1. In sociology, "alienation" means:
(a) a rabbit
(b) a ball-point pen
(c) seventeen
(d) the Aegean Sea

What would you answer? And how much weight would you give the results?
If you didn't get the same answer as the tester, what do you think that
would say about your knowledge of sociology?

Only one or two questions were like this,

Not so.

<snip>

I'll have to ask you to leave this discussion.

You can ask. That's what freedom of speech is all about.

--
Richard Heathfield <http://www.cpax.org.uk>
Email: -http://www. +rjh@
Google users: <http://www.cpax.org.uk/prg/writings/googly.php>
"Usenet is a strange place" - dmr 29 July 1999
.