Re: The proof that I was referring to is on the website

From: Peter Olcott (olcott_at_worldnet.att.net)
Date: 08/11/04 

Date: Wed, 11 Aug 2004 01:27:19 GMT

<newstome@comcast.net> wrote in message news:gK5Sc.262164$JR4.167687@attbi_s54...
> In comp.theory Peter Olcott <olcott@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
> > <newstome@comcast.net> wrote in message news:oUWRc.229589$a24.164871@attbi_s03...
> >> In comp.theory Peter Olcott <olcott@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
> >> >
> >
> >> And as been explained to you many times, this is where you're wrong.
> >> If a TM can compute the correct result, and supply that correct result
> >> to anyone, anyhow (write-once tape, write-only screen, beeping it out
> >> in morse code through a sound card -- I don't care how), then there's
> >> also a TM that can compute the correct result and return it. Since
> >> that second part (with returning the result) is impossible for the
> >> halting problem, so is the first part (with returning it in some
> >> secret, newfangled way).
> >
> > ICFANV Incorrect Reasoning based on a False Assumption thatis Never
> > Validated.
> >
> > The TM that returns its result to write only screen memory has an
> > entirely different execution trace than the exact same TM the returns
> > its result to the TM being analyzed for this specific Halting Problem.
>
> Wrong again. A TM that returns its result to "write only screen
> memory" has absolutely NO difference in execution trace from that same
> program run under a simulator of such a machine, executing on a
> machine without such a "write only screen memory." No difference at
> all. Exactly the same "execution trace". It's impossible for the

Mine always provides the correct results every time.
If you do anything to change this, then it would necessarily
have a different execution trace.

> program to tell the difference. And in the simulator, I can easily
> capture the output to the "write only screen memory" and do whatever I
> want to with it.
>
> > LoopIfHalts does not "loop if halts" it only loops if you tell it that
> > it halts. If you don't tell it that it halts, then it does not loop. If you
> > tell someone else (write only screen memory) and do not tell it, then
> > it halts. Whenever you tell it that it halts, it loops. So not telling it
> > and telling someone else, has an entirely different effect than telling
> > it, and not telling someone else.
>
> Unfortunately for your argument, you simply can't tell if it has been
> told to someone else or not.
>
> > Since its behavior is changed when you tell it that it halts, as compared
> > to not telling it (and telling the write only screen memory) therefore the
> > analysis is also changed. Only by returning the result to the program being
> > analyzed is the Halting Problem indeterminate. If you simply refrain from
> > telling the program being analyzed any of the results of the analysis, what
> > was indeterminate becomes determinate.
>
> Since there's no actual difference between returning the result to the
> caller or sending it to "write once screen memory", your code for the
> halting problem with either work in both cases, or fail in both
> cases. And in fact, it will fail in both cases.
>
> --
>
> That's News To Me!
> newstome@comcast.net

Relevant Pages

  • Re: The proof that I was referring to is on the website
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