Re: PHP5 a threat, or a complement to server-side java?
From: Willy Kreim (willykk_at_my-deja.com)
Date: 05/14/04
- Next message: bitbucket43: "Re: PHP5 a threat, or a complement to server-side java?"
- Previous message: Roedy Green: "Re: ascii code for a tab?"
- In reply to: Sudsy: "Re: PHP5 a threat, or a complement to server-side java?"
- Next in thread: Tim Tyler: "Re: PHP5 a threat, or a complement to server-side java?"
- Messages sorted by: [ date ] [ thread ] [ subject ] [ author ]
Date: 13 May 2004 17:31:07 -0700
Sudsy <bitbucket44@hotmail.com> wrote in message news:<40A38039.6090100@hotmail.com>...
> Willy Kreim wrote:
> <snip>
> > I'm of the opinion that PHP5 is a big threat to Microsoft's
> > ASP-dot-Net.
> <snip>
> > I'm
> > just trying to think about how Sun could face the surging popularity
> > of PHP...
>
> I don't know where you're getting your information but it seems very
> biased. I mean, "surging popularity"?!
I'm seeing more and more people dumping the IIS + ASP combo due to the
security issues, concerns about vendor lock-in, and those people who
used to run IIS and ASP pages are instead installing Apache (even on
Win2k/XP), and moving their scripts to PHP.
In a sense, I think PHP is going to take a lot of market share from
Microsoft's ASP (more than it's already taking).
This, I think, is a good move. Once people drop IIS and ASP, they'll
start running Apache, caring more about cross-platform portability
(maybe moving their web servers to unix/linux), and exploring more
powerful, cross-platform tools (like jsp, servlets and Server-Side
java).
What I currently DON'T see is Sun making a big push for JSP, or trying
to educate people who drop IIS and ASP and go to PHP into the virtues
of Java. Hence my message about how Sun could benefit from the PHP 5
momentum.
In short: MINDSHARE, MINDSHARE, MINDSHARE. Like it or not, PHP has
more mindshare on the linux community than jsp. And this SHOULD BE
WORKED ON, imho.
Otherwise jsp and java risks becoming just "an enterprise thing" (like
Cobol, Smalltalk and the like) and not a synonym of the web and web
development.
> Do you know what PHP stands
> for? Personal Home Page!
I thought it was php hypertext preprocessor. ;)
> I see more feet doing the walking TO server side Java, for all the
> good and usual reasons. You have to decide whether you want to deploy
> on an industrial-strength foundation or something else. I know where
> my money is sitting...
Agreed when thinking about large developments and the Fortune 500 and
large corporations, but when I wrote my original post I was thinking
more about general geek mindshare, you know, the slashdot population.
I'm thinking about JSP vs. PHP mindshare. Just count on the number of
ready-made scripts that someone wishing to create a web community,
portal, intranet, news site, discussion forums, etc can find on the
php camp vs. .jsp. For example, until recently, there were no decent
FREE jsp based discussion forum scripts, like phpBB. When I asked
around I was directed to JiveForums, a VERY expensive commercial
offering.
This is an area where PHP mindshare outnumbers JSP greatly. And as I
said, I see Sun doing almost nothing to promote JSP script development
and usage. "Built (a great language) and they'll come (the
developers)" is not a good strategy.
Thankfully, things started improving slowly recently (last ~ 12
months) and now there are a few decent jsp based discussion forum
scripts available, but it took the jsp camp ages to reach the php
camp. (Maybe this is due to the easier to learn nature of php?,
getting more beginner's mindshare?).
Here's a good jsp based discussion forum script I'm using on my sites,
btw, and with which I could finally replace all my php scripts
http://yazd.yasna.com/beta/index.jsp
> (Of course this could also be a troll)
Believe me, I'm not. I just think that PHP5 will accelerate php's
mindshare and usage growth across the web, and I'd hate to see JSP and
java confined to marginal mindshare like Sun allowed to happen to the
Netscape Enterprise / Sun One web server vs. Apache.
So I repeat / rephrase my question: what can Sun do to lure php
developers into jsp and java? And will they do their best effort
towards this goal? what about building bridges between the two
development communities?
Regards,
Willy.
- Next message: bitbucket43: "Re: PHP5 a threat, or a complement to server-side java?"
- Previous message: Roedy Green: "Re: ascii code for a tab?"
- In reply to: Sudsy: "Re: PHP5 a threat, or a complement to server-side java?"
- Next in thread: Tim Tyler: "Re: PHP5 a threat, or a complement to server-side java?"
- Messages sorted by: [ date ] [ thread ] [ subject ] [ author ]
Relevant Pages
|
