Re: A lisp foundation - a model for open source development?

On 22 août, 14:11, Slobodan Blazeski <slobodan.blaze...@xxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
On Aug 22, 10:17 am, Christophe





<christophe.allegr...@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
On 20 août, 17:10, Slobodan Blazeski <slobodan.blaze...@xxxxxxxxx>
wrote:

I have an idea how improve things in the lisp world, though I'm very
skeptical how well it could work, but maybe, just maybe it could be
inspiration for something that will help the lisp community to
prosper.
At first my very simple and probably inaccurate view of the open
source funding.
The open source model works sometimes even with very few money like
when people share common problem and develop solution together ,
something like Apache & FreeBSD project (as per my knowledge FreeBSD
foundations gets only 250 000 a year which is silly considering the
size of the project), for the rest of the projects you need a wealthy
sponsors and/or be very popular so you could count on donations or
ads. The rest of the open source world survive from
consultancy and dual licensing, mysql is the best example. Of course
there are people doing open source as hobby, who get support from
their day jobs.
Lisp doesn't stand very well in terms of popularity so money from ads
and donations are minor, therw is no wealthy corporate or government
sponsor, nor horde of programmers so clusters of people who work in
the same field will form. All of the above popularity, sponsorship and
horde of programmers are intermingled, in order to gain programmers
lisp needs a lot of high quality libraries, to gain a lot of high
quality libraries we need sponsors, to gain sponsors we need to be
popular and to be popular lisp needs programmers, so we're trapped in
a vicious cycle of poverty and don't know how to break it.
Maybe this could help. Create an foundation, let's call it Alexandria
for now, that will held lisp libraries that their authors wanted to
deposit under foundation library.
Create the organization license, let's call it Alexandria license,
with terms as per below:
1. The usual no warranty staffs & disclaimers perhaps from the boost
license
2. The code taken from the foundation code base can't be relicensed
Only the author/copyright holder of the specific library could do that
but the copy already deposited stays under Alexandria license for
good.
3.. The code deposited can't be withdrawn.
4. You could use the deposited library under one of the below terms:
a Free of charge if you deposit all the code from the project that
uses Alexandria library in the Alexandria foundation ( GNU viral
effect enabling code base to grow)
b. You could pay a certain fee to the foundation so you will only have
to open the code from the functionality that is already implemented
(like LLGPL, so implemented functionality will grow in quality) plus
user could donate additional functionality if he wants that.
c. Make another deal with the author/copyright holder of the library
deposited. Author /copyright could offer different terms for the code
he holds copyright.

The problems with my idea are :
1. Find someone(s) who will establish & take care of the foundation
2. Finding athors to deposit libraries.
3. What kind of fees to ask for? One fee to use all the libraries?
Separate fee for each library? Or combination of both? How much to
charge for the use and who will decide the price author or foundation?
4. How to split the revenues?

The questions are many and someone have to solve to make this work. Or
find out different model.
Is there anybody interested to put words into practice ?

Kind regards

Bobi

Hello,

Perhaps it's a good idea, but bad example.
Without IBM, Apache never had the resources for growing.

I have a doubt that IBM or SUN sponsor a Lisp foundation at this time.

Christophe- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

I'm not sure even that it is a good idea, but anyway there's nobody
interested in trying so we should do with what we can do, and one of
those things are to produce libraries thus avoid being the language
that only some weird freaks without any touch with reality use it .http://www.amazon.com/gp/discussionboard/discussion.html/ref=cm_rdp_s...
Maybe if someone could figure out how to create a Weitz virus,
Rosenberg, Caekenberghe, King & simigliar mutations are highly
wellcome. Or maybe just preventing lispers from getting ill from the
whiner syndrom ( a.k.a Erann Gatt syndrom) would turn the tables.
Perhaps. Just perhaps.

The best the little guy can do is what
the little guy does righthttp://www.openbsd.org/lyrics.html#41- Masquer le texte des messages précédents -

- Afficher le texte des messages précédents -

At this time, the most advanced Lisp is Allegro CL. Lispwork is also a
good candidate.
I prefer used my time to create anything with it or for it, rather
that tried to create or improve SBCL, for example.

About libraries, http://common-lisp.net/ is a very good work.
And the website : http://www.cl-user.net is also a very good work.

About the "Erann Gatt syndrom", the problem is developer level in
Computer Sciences, not Lisp. Cf. : http://www.lambdassociates.org/blog/decline.htm

Regards,

Christophe


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