Re: [PHP] Beginner Tutorials for using CLASSES in PHP4


""Nathan Nobbe"" <quickshiftin@xxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:7dd2dc0b0710091843g3582f7d1q4d2841447b05d327@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
On 10/9/07, Tony Marston <tony@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:


""Nathan Nobbe"" <quickshiftin@xxxxxxxxx> wrote in message
news:7dd2dc0b0710091529o78441a3fib0780f8c87ef00be@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
On 10/9/07, Tony Marston <tony@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:

There's your problem, then. You are wasting your time trying to
implement
fancy design patterns just because design patterns are supposed to be
"cool". Loader class, Controller Base class, Front Controller - I
have
none
of that crap in my code, so I don't encounter the problems you have.


your site talks about the use of mvc in radicore so we can assume youre
using at least one design pattern;

When I say that I do not use design patterns I mean that I do not try to
implemet as many design patterns as possible,


i never suggested any one do that nor did i suggest that i do that.

and I certainly do not litter
my conversations with this pattern or that pattern.

then you failed to grasp one of the most important concepts about design
patterns.
they provide a common vocabulary to allow designers to talk about
implementing
systems at a high level without having to waste time talking about
specific
details.

Yes, but many of today's programmers regard design patterns with a religious
zeal which borders on fanaticism. Such people cannot bring anything of value
to the conversation.

In the whole of my
career there have only ever been two patterns that I have read about and
subsequently sought to implement, and thoose are the Three Tier
Architecture
and the Singleton. The fact that my framework contains an example of MVC
is
pure coincidence. It just happened that way. It was only after someone
else
looked at my code and said "You've implemented the MVC pattern" that I
read
about it and discovered that it was a perfect match. I certainly did not
read about MVC and then try to implement it.


that is very common. many if not most people implement patterns all the
time and dont realize it.

Just because someone may see a pattern in my code does not mean that I first
studied the pattern and then implemented it. I wrote the code without any
knowledge of the pattern, therefore I did not use the pattern when writing
my code.

one benefit of patterns is people can communicate at the pattern
level. recognition is powerful as well; if you happen to see a pattern
when
you are working out a design; the pieces just fall into place; or at least
you have
a road map.

I don't waste my time talking about design patterns to the pattern zealots.
It is as productive as attempting to have a theological discussion with a
religeous fanatic - a total waste of time unless you share their point of
view.

Too many of today's programmers can only "see" patterns after they have read
about them in a book. They vie with each other to see how many patterns they
can juggle at the same time, or complain that someone els'e implementation
of a particular pattern is "unsound" or "impure".

and if radicore has a single point of entry you are using a front
controller.

I do not have a single point entry. Each page has its own controller, so
I
have hundreds of page controllers. A single front controller is something
that is used in compiled languages.


its also used heavily in php; take a look at code igniter for a first
example.

Just because people use font controllers in PHP does not make them a good
thing. I personally think they are crap.

might want to knock the dust off the old design pattern books just to jog
your memory:)

I've put my books of design patterns on the top shelf where they shall
remain untouched as they contain nothing of use to me. They may give
hints
to novices, but I am no longer a novice. I no longer need training wheels
on my bicycle, so why do I need books on design patterns?


ill be honest; i like what youve done w/ xsl, you even taught me some
things; but when it comes to oop; well i think you should get the books
back down from the top shelf.

-nathan


Why? What is wrong with my implementation of OOP? Surely I have used
encapsulation, inheritance and polymorphism to increase code reuse and
decrease maintenance, therefore my implementation can only be regarded as
effective. The fact that you don't like my style is your problem, not mine.

--
Tony Marston
http://www.tonymarston.net
http://www.radicore.org
.

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